Ever felt the call of the wild and wanted to capture iconic travel images like the pros? Hear from professional travel photographers John and Lisa Merrill on their experiences from growing from amateur to pro, with a lot of adventure along the way. Listen in for tips and tricks for everything from DSLR cameras to iPhones and how to combine your unique view of the world with stunning images. Merrill Images is celebrating 25 years in business this year. They share how they've made it work, and how a change in the world allowed them to learn even more ways to create images and connect with photographers around the world.
In this episode, Captain Dan reconnects with the passion of capturing an image and the importance of conversation in photography where ever you are traveling. This is a great source for travel photography with plenty of travel adventures to share. Listen in on stories from small boat cruising, to overseas biking stories and mistaking a whale for a bear. Captain Dan continues to weave his stories and share his knowledge of the world through conversations with diverse people. Join us!
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Hey adventures. Welcome to the no ordinary adventurer podcast, a place we call home for adventure and the conversations you want to have. We bring you inspiration stories from the field and talk with adventure travelers and industry experts from around the world. This is a place to fill your heart and head with travel knowledge. Now, your host Dan Blanchard, a lifelong Mariner traveler and CEO of UnCruise Adventures, a small boat adventure company defining the UN in UnCruise. Let's get started. Well, welcome this Captain Dan Blanchard of UnCruise Adventures here with another great podcast. And today, I got some folks that you're going to be very interested in because not only have they traveled on our boats before, but I just reviewed a lot of images that they had taken when they were down aboard the safari voyage or in Panama and Costa Rica. And I have to say, I got a little emotional about it. Looking at all those pictures crew members I haven't seen in a long time, it was appropriate to say welcome. And tell us about you guys. I mean, what's your life story? What do you do on these days? Well, we founded Merrill images back in 1986. So we, along with UnCruise are celebrating our 25th year in business. So congratulations. We met with Lisa answer my personal ad in the Seattle Weekly This was pre internet. So the technology was newspaper and voicemail. And at the time we had other other careers. I was in renewable energy, and Lisa did high tech marketing. And we started taking photo workshops on the weekends. In fact, here on Whidbey Island, where we're going to be teaching in a couple weeks, we took like 10 or 12 different courses from people that are really great photographers that have become friends and mentors over the years. We actually developing film in a local community college darkroom. And we did that for a few years. And then we ended up at a sort of a transition point in our both of our careers at the same time. So we quit our jobs. And we traveled around the world for a year. We took good. Yeah, it was, it was amazing, because before we had kids, we took a few 100 rolls of film, and just took off, went to Central America, we went to Asia, we went to Africa. And it was an amazing trip. And we came back with lots of great pictures and signed contracts with two stock agencies, became professional photographers, and founded Merrill Lynch's later. And I always tell people that photography has morphed with our life. So we're very adventurous, like most of your own cruise listeners. So we've worked with a lot of outdoor adventure companies, as clients and over time did a lot of trades with hotels and resorts and regional tourism. Our own Seattle area is growing. And we support the efforts of local communities Bellevue and Kirkland where we live. And then we got into having a family and our photography got into families and portraits and kids sports and some real mixes, travel photographers, we are always with our cameras. And life is just visually, I call it a visual scavenger hunt. We're always seeing light and stuff. And we we use our cameras to connect with people. And now we're teaching a lot. That side life. Two minutes. Yeah. I like it. I like it. So I mean, so you have this adventure, some outlook. And I have to say I was the same way when when my children were young, we sailed across the oceans and a little sailboat and did all this stuff. And you know, adventuring, I think for in raising a family is one of the best ways to expose young minds to our world, I think we'd have a lot fewer bores. If every family was capable. We're blessed. I will say that bill to do that that kind of morphed into finding little old UnCruise Adventures. How did that all happen? You know, that's a good question. Um, we both have business degrees, and that has helped, you know, in terms of photography, we still are always evolving our craft and learning but the business background and photography, the stock that John mentioned in the 90s. That was really lucrative. There weren't that many photographers and we our slides were being shipped to clients, there was no internet. I mean, we're really talking a while ago, so we have evolved and over time teaching became a big part of our lives and we love it and so we think we'd known some other photographers have come out with you. Natalie folks is a friend of ours and and so we just reached out I think we're all part of the adventure travel Association. It's in Seattle. That's where I first met you once and So we kind of reached out and it evolved. And it was a really great experience. And we have lifelong friends, both the guides and the other clients we were working with. Yeah, I think that's back when they venture travel trade association used to have a thing called adventure drinks. Where the entire adventure travel community we'd get together. I know, I would fly down. And you know, a lot of Alaskans. I mean, we always look forward to that they've kind of changed it over the years with COVID. But hopefully, we'll get back to it soon. Glass with you as I would look forward to it. That'd be great. So what's between the two of you? How do you break up these roles? I mean, who is the master photographer? Who's the writer? I mean, how does that kind of work with you guys? So we're both photographers. And as Lisa mentioned, you know, we continually evolve our craft and learn new things, you know, new cameras, new technologies, and we've had a lot of fun learning from our clients, their camera gear, you know, which is new to the way they see, you know, it's, it's amazing how different people see the same thing differently. In terms of roles. Lisa is our is our marketer, and sort of, she does that marketing strategy. You know, she's on social media. And she's reaching out, you know, to folks, like UnCruise, and many, many, many others. And I do sort of them that I take care of the camera gear, you know, and, like, we have this travel trailer that we drive around, you know, drive around. So I do all the sort of the back office stuff and computers, which is, yeah, I'm the I'm also the IT guy in the office. My third drone, and I haven't learned how yet, so we, you know, we do and talk, but when we're in the field teaching, that's one thing that, you know, students get both of us, and we have different approaches, explain things and we kind of move around. And you know, in settings, where we're with people doing photo coaching, and I think that's a nice thing to have two perspectives and two teacher. Oh, that's so awesome. I mean, you know, let's just face it, not every couple can be not only love, but be a business together. And their situation. Yeah, it doesn't happen well, with everybody. But when it happens, it rocks. You, you were down in Panama with somebody tell us about that experience. Because those images are so strong and just vibrant with the energy of the tropics. I mean, what was that like for you being on a cruise and bringing guests and take pictures and all this benefit? I will say, you know, we had been to Costa Rica for a month, a long time ago, we never set foot in Panama. The, the itinerary was so carefully crafted, it was, you know, I always tell people top notch on all levels, whether we're talking where we went, the safari itself, you know, the staff was huge, a part of our we had a lot of interaction met, most of your guys were really avid photographers on that particular journey. And they were both learning and sharing and eager, we had brought some extra camera gear along and not all of the guests wanted to use it. So if the guests didn't want to we had Monica and Luis, out there testing some stuff out, I would say highlights for me was the trip to the Embera village up the river. And you know, I'll never forget being greeted, and every single guest being taken hand in hand, I think you saw some of the images and walked a really nice long walk as the village was set off from the river. And you know, those kinds of people were a little leery at first, what's this going to be like? We, our guest voiced some apprehension, how is the interaction going to go? And we've been to a lot of different things like that. And it was, people were crying. I mean, it was a good about a three hour visit with with a good cultural discussion that was translated with time to dance together. I mean, there's something about dancing. And the whole experience I would say was the most of the rest of the trip John may share was wildlife intensive and really beautiful kayaking and a lot of great wildlife. But that particular cultural interaction was something I'll treasure forever for me to stay because you do have that, you know, you look at the difference between Costa Rica and Panama and people know Costa Rica in their minds, right. But what when I was doing the research, you know, I'd been to Panama and Costa Rica before I found out that oh my gosh, from a native cultural standpoint, analyze off the hook. I mean, you're off the hook. And we're Costa Rica is more about wild nature and not so much a cultural event. might say. So I hear what you're saying about the whole Embera bribes throughout Costa Rica Well, excuse me throughout parts of Panama being such a delightful thing. So when you look at kind of the difference of switching from being an amateur photographer, when you were doing your personal trips to now are a long time being exceptional, professional photographers, what, how does that shift work? I mean, how did you guys transfer it? And what like, what what advice would you give a 24 year old that's out of college just loves travel, but wants to maybe move into your neck of the woods. With that I don't want to give any secrets away. Now. I say two sets of advice. So one is kind of all talk. And that one is for that the person who doesn't. And then there is just tips of the trade for travel, which we're happy to share with you. But as far as someone who's starting out, you know, we're always about learning. And that can be a few things we do know some really good intensive like Rocky Mountain School photography has a 10 week summer intensive, that's pretty life changing. And there are classes at most community colleges, which are really good. online photography, education has exploded during COVID. And even before but wow, I'm watching a few a week. So it's learning your craft, that's also finding someone who's doing what you might want to do. I mean, for us in life, people have helped us along the way. And now when we talk about paying it forward, and people are usually really willing to work with others, and well, business advice or photo advice. And then, you know, people have told this to us a lot. And I think it's true more now than ever, it's a crowded field. There's lots of people, cameras are getting better and better. And there's a lot of images online easily assessable. So if you have a niche, you know, an area of interest, whether it's your own region, whether it's a particular species as something that can help, they can help you start to reach out to people who might use your photos. And the other thing we say is before you get paid volunteer, sometimes you got to build up your portfolio and find some clients. And if you're really new starting out, you know, that's another thing. Maybe those would you add anything I would add, you know, you got to practice your craft, you know, the quality of light and photography is so, so important. So, you know, we get up early, and we're out late until the sun goes down a lot. And, you know, it's like Malcolm Gladwell says, you know, 10,000 hours and you become an expert. I love Yes, by the way. Yeah. I am this winner. Oh, my God, we just love that audio. We are the audiobook, obviously. 1000 hours. That's, it's true for photography. I mean, you you got to, you got to practice in notes, as least as Lisa said, you know, find him find a mentor, or, you know, mentor or to the photography community is really a gracious giving group, we've found so many people that have helped us along the way, and they're, you know, they're accessible in your community. Let's pretend you're back on board the boat, we're going to get you on in the future. Yeah, what would be like if you were sitting here, we were talking on the boat, which is just by the way down here. It's just down here, like 50 feet away from me right now. So we're on board, let's say the support request and we're getting ready to head out you have your first opening statement to guess what give me the three most important thing for somebody that uses like an iPhone 12 like me to take pictures, what are the three most important things, whether they're how you work the camera, or faults people make? Or what are some of the tools that you generally look out when you think of people using phones as their case? And because we helped a lot of people it's increasingly a big part of our education. No, and people always want to get into features and megabits and pixels, and the three that will give you are for any camera, whether it's phone DSLR mirrorless and it really are a lot of what's up here we've talked about the mindset as much as anything but capturing the experience and not the sights is a big one for us what you know the the travel experience, which goes so well with UnCruise whether it's yourself your family's interaction is really, really interesting. It's challenging but life happens vitality, rather than putting your people in front of a palm tree or a beach and taking that standing still, which is so often the inclination but I would just say you become like a photo journalist of your own life and really watch out for interactions, emotions, action that would be tip number one pulls the heart in a way, kind of kick. Yeah, what's happening in the photo, it's harder, and people tend to get the grown up with, you know, let's all stare at the camera with their arms straight. And it's just they get boring. The other one is, is really I mentioned mindset. But we talked a lot about mindful photography and intentionality. And our biggest tip is to slow down. And to really think about the images, you're trying to create what you like, and we're always urging the people we work with, to make not take photos, it's a real, it's a wording, but it's a mindset. And, and to make more than one, if you like something, and to ask yourself, How could this be stronger, which we teach a lot through examples, and we pull from our files of an image we love and one that we that wasn't so great, and people love to learn that way. Most, a lot of photographers are visual learners. So I would say, experimenting and playing a bit like, you know, yeah, you'll get some great images, but we want it to be joyful. And the third one, the third one is to vary your perspective. Like if you if you make every photo from ilevel, there will be a bit of a sameness so we are encouraged people climb up on the UnCruise climb up to the top deck, climbed down and side view, a lot of cameras have tilting screens these days, which is great. When we bring people out recently to the tulip fields, we had knee pads, so it was comfortable for everyone to get really low on the farms and look up at the tulips. So I think that would be three capture the experience slowed down, and very your perspective. And the perspective helps you get different backgrounds and different light which what we teach. That is so true. I am before John, I do want to hear if you have anything different but also I just have to tell you I just got a puppy right Megan and I have a little puppy we haven't had a puppy before. And I just learned that I and your advice was so right on the perspective because I had taken I've been taking pictures of me standing up with a puppy down below. And all of a sudden I dropped it to the floor. And oh my gosh, that is my little puppy. I want to see you being tremendously Yeah, maybe just now before this podcast that the farm on wimpy and there was a dog in the farmhouse and the owner is really love their dog and I got really pretty much on my elbows. She got this dog in the middle of the pepper plants. Yeah, their eyes, the eyes in in pets and animals in people is such an important part of an image. And if you're, if you're much higher, sometimes low can work to but much lower than an eye level. Eye level really tends to work well with other people and animals. Whether they're wild or no. Domestic, when you look for catch light in the eye to you know, catch light when the light hits it in their eyes come alive little blends. That's That's nice. Okay, well I can tell you what I want to be doing after this podcast. Good. By the way, my little puppies name is Kiku named after some islands right here in southeast Alaska. So just had to throw that out there. I'm sorry. I think you're on cruise listeners to this podcast need to see Kiku to and your flash. Flash if you image you might have to haul him in here. We've been doing rover hosting during the pandemic and I've had about 20 different dogs in our home on when we're not out in our trailer photographing or teaching and it's been a joy and I photograph every dog and love it. It's so I learned that taking the pitchers. John, your advice on getting low and seeing the eyes is brilliant. And I think our guests really love it. When we have our photography, three trips, and folks are on sharing because, you know, they're able to learn about capturing it. I just met the guest coming off the boat and they saw I haven't seen the images yet. They saw a very rare thing. They sought to Arkham meeting for about two hours long. It that's happened in my 35 or 40 years in the business. That's happened twice and one just happened. hooking it up restarting for COVID. So I'm pretty happy. And just it's helpful and it's exciting, you know, and I was thinking about the eyes. We saw a lot of giant ganas on our trip and we were in the sand getting you know, on our elbows to get that eye level view and sometimes it's a very physical thing and it's a lot of fun. So do you have you know from all your adventuring I am sure you have stories to us like I do that are kind of maybe the Don't even relate to photography. Maybe they relate more to adventuring. You have a, you know, a specific memory that you each kind of look back at on or maybe it's individual that just just kind of gives you the life. Yeah, no, that's, I love that question because it brings up stories and memories. Um, mine was Ecuador, we did a one month trip with little tiny Bryce and VIV our kids and my mom came. And that was the first time we hired a guide, as a family. And, boy, I really learned the value of that often, you know, we were independent. We were younger. We were backpackers. We were there with the financials, but the guide, and having that long term, we are still friends, but the way he won opened up the country to us in terms of experiences and deep connections and just, you know, that time to develop and really discuss things, it was profound. And I now whenever we go places on our own, even, you know, scouting trips before we'll bring our clients with us, we find great guides, and they are so a key part. And that's what you know, when you asked about UnCruise, before, the guides that you had the naturalist, the university trained, knowledgeable, friendly, approachable, people made the trip. And we once we saw like a mega pod of dolphins, and the you know, that happens, I guess, and the guests were just so excited. And we waited. And really, it was just joyful, but one of the guys was in the shower, and she missed it, Monica. And I'll never forget when she came out how upset she was. And I'm like, you see this all the time, didn't matter, she you know, the size of that pod. And that, you know, it was just fun to you know, that there was still so special to her. And then and so guides are a huge part of it for us and that Ecuadorian guy who I'm still in touch with, you know, has a family and it's 20 years later, and we're still in touch, you know, so many wonderful experiences through travel. And, you know, we really can use our photography to connect with people slick, I'm a little bit introverted, and it kind of like is my, my excuse or my tool to really get to know people, you know, by establishing rapport, which is really, really important to get good pictures, you've really got to establish rapport with people to get good pictures you need. So, you know, it's our way of connecting with the world and the people that we meet around the world. That sort of a specific instance that comes to mind is we're in Cuba, we love Cuba, we've been many times and we can't wait to go back when the time is right. But we were photographing dancer dancers industry, and we introduced ourselves and make friends. And it led to us taking dance lessons salsa with some of the dancers. And it was just like this. It was this awesome experience. So we really got to know, you know, the people and we learned how to do salsa. Yeah, we're probably pretty rusty. No, but it was just it was a blast. And, you know, we saw a piece of Cuban culture and Cuban life that we just wouldn't have seen otherwise, if we hadn't made that, that connection. So that that kind of thing happens to us, you know, wherever we travel, and it's just, you know, part of who we are and why we love photography. Oh, yeah, I Yeah, well, you know, once you have that connection, that is the magic sauce, isn't it? It at the end of the day, we are all going to have great images of some kind, either in our head or in our in our books or are stored away. But many times is that all about the real memories, the richness of the human experience that is lasting and those photographs just bring it right back to life. I'll share a really quick story that tried to make it quick. I've never shared on a video or outside my family and work folks but I have two kids and up until they are in their mid 20s I would take a week off with each one of them to do some kind of event as often as I could. wasn't always every year but so my daughter eight years ago, so he would have been 27 I guess who's the captain of the sportquest right out here and now. We decided to kayak from Wrangell Alaska, Ketchikan Alaska in May May 1 Actually, and it's a really very time there's not a lot of food out so the bears are scraping up rocks and trying to get food. So we are picking very small islands to go to the bears wouldn't have interest. Last day of the trip comes I hop out of my kayak I have my bear spray I had keep my lifejacket on and the routine is I go up the beach. Look for Bear sign oh my gosh, they're sign everywhere trees ripped air scat holes in the Eaton ruts. And but we have no place else to go. It's about 10 at night and we decided to camp there. So be in the safe dad I said sticks up all around the perimeter. So if a bear comes close, we'll hear it snap. We have a drill. We're both laying in our tent. We if we ever hear anything, we instantly turn on our lights. Our headlamps can make a big orange or brown or about a tent. And then we grab our bear spray and I I hear this in the middle of the night too. In the morning. I hear this today we got a bear, we got a bear. And I you know I turn on the lights. She's getting hers and and then I said you're ready and I have the bear spray in my hand. I'm getting ready to drop the zipper and I look over and she is laughing so hard. She's crying. She goes Dad, it's a whale. And sure enough, right off the edge of about a 20 foot bag. There are probably two or three what we call trumpeter humpbacks in south east where they have a deviated septum. And instead of it going, it goes. And so there was my protection of my daughter from the dangerous humpback whale. Oh, yeah, adventures happen. So with viral images, where are you going from here? What's the future look like in the do? Other COVID world that we're like CDC just came out with some great stuff yesterday, how vaccinated people can get out more? I mean, what is the future for you to going forward? No, thank you for asking. You know, we are we're hopeful we this past year, we kind of pivoted and did like many photographers, a lot of online teaching and grew. I call it our tribe, a lot of local Seattleites. And we also in the fall did save socially distance Photowalks six people eight feet apart, wearing masks got people out lots to farms, different places in Seattle that were fun. So we now are positioned where we're on Whidbey Island scouting locations, because in just three weeks we have our first in person workshop since the pandemic a four day travel photography at the Pacific Northwest art school, which is where 27 years ago, we started taking classes took about so it's kind of come full circle. So that's exciting. We're going to be home in the Northwest a lot this summer, our sons coming to work remotely from LA and we love Seattle in the summer, have a trailer. But we are planning ahead, we filled our Vietnam trip which we did have to postpone in the pandemic. And now we've got a waiting list for next April. And I'm very hopeful for that it'll go to week trips throughout north and central Vietnam. And, you know, we still teaching a lot via zoom. We'll keep doing that both one on one photo coaching. And we run a small group called jumpstart your photography, which is a three session workshop where we have five people up to two hour sessions and then they we have assignments and people come back together and share images. So that's what we're doing. We're planning ahead and looking ahead to other things as well. We in the fall will still be mostly domestic and we have our trailer will be down in Moab and Colorado for the fall color. I love it. I do a Tucson workshop is people you know what, there's a lot of pent up travel demand. I know you're finding that and we're just planning to capitalize on it. Our kids are now launched and we have that travel left lust is stronger than ever wanderlust. So we'll see where it takes us. Wow, that sounds terrific. I mean, what a way to restart. And I'm also we I didn't mention but we do a lot of work for nonprofits and NGOs, both locally and when we travel. So Wednesday, I'm speaking at a big Washington nonprofits conference on visual storytelling for nonprofits and helping a lot of the travel skills we teach are applicable to organizations doing good work in their community. We encourage a lot of our students to volunteer or get a paid job with some of these NGOs. But we'll be you know, what kind of growing a lot of the content that we use, that's kind of you know, labor intensive PowerPoint images, we're going through our queue of images that have continued to grow. There's not never a long there's never a finished to do list I should say but it's it's diverse work and we like it. Yep, we did just have a yesterday we had a conversation with our our guides in Cuba, and he's actually here in the States right now, but she's going back and in the fall and he's going to escape, you know, scout out a potential threat For us, you know, as early as, as next year 23 Well, we'll give it some time to go that long. But we're excited about going back to Cuba as well, why we think so that is so good. I, you know, it's one thing that's come up in this conversation several times are guides, you mentioned Monica, I sprayed messages with her all the time. She's a really great guy from Costa Rica, as you know. And, and she was one of about 15, Costa Rican. So we put out a grant where we went to all our past guests and said, hey, you know, they don't have unemployment like we do in the United States. And he was one of about 15 that managed to get one of those grants. So we're really happy to see that. But, you know, I, you mentioned Vietnam, you mentioned the guides, and Ecuador. And they have had come to believe the same thing I used to travel and backpack and all that stuff, and kind of considered myself, oh, you know, we're gonna find all the great, you don't find the great spots, the guides, still really great spots are that I would have Megan and I went to Vietnam a couple years ago, just before COVID. And and I have to say we we took had a guide there and we just loved it so much. So I look forward to hearing your stories about that. I think some of our when you talk about funded travel of Vietnam is just so great. So a lot, a lot of effort into the itinerary. And we look for partners like, you know, an on cruise that really has shares our philosophy of travel, our approach to communities benefiting sustainability. And then we really work closely and the trips we develop and the partnerships we want to repeat. Like I could go back to Vietnam and Cuba each year, John and I look, usually we'll explore a new place before the careful itinerary. But it's just, you know, there's a lot while I do have a long list of places, I've never been that people are surprised we both never been to Iceland, we not been to New Zealand, and we're travel photographers, but you know, hopefully life is long, and we'll get there. But there is a real I love going back to places too. Well, we're getting short on time here. But it's been good to reconnect. And we'll keep we'll keep in Taos, was there any last advice you want to pass out to folks on? Oh, get that great emotional picture or anything, any advice to throw out? You know, with my I always talk to people, it's just keep it fun. You know, it's if you miss a photo, it doesn't, you know, in the long scheme of things that it's about your your time with each other wherever you are, and there are we still miss photos like okay, you know, that was a great experience. I wish I had a thought it doesn't always happen. But you know that that mindset matters. And I think what we've all found this year is you know, to really think about what matters most in your life and bring joy to yourself. I think we know photography can be a real great source of creativity and joy. And we're one of the things we didn't talk about sharing I guess for a second is we a lot of our Photowalks we get people into this thing called intentional camera movement. You can look it up ICM, it's a genre, but it's really about waving your camera around with a slow shutter speed. And on the iPhones, you can get an app called slow shutter cam. And our students are making these impressionistic. I mean, there aren't I don't think I will see if we had any to the UnCruise valley, but they're just so fun. And inevitably we get people say, I didn't think I would like that kind of photography. But boy, I'm so I can't believe I created this shot. And so that gives me pleasure to bring joy. Because we've all you know, whenever you've been through this year, it's been challenging, and to you know, take the joys you can find and if photography is one of them, we'd love to help you. And whether I'm on cruise or not, you know, Marilyn images, we're here for you. And we hope listeners will reach out to us we welcome questions and love to just get to know others who share a passion for both travel and photography. I love it. I've got a I got a whole page of notes. I will slow shutter speed out I had no idea. So it's fun. It's really fun. Yeah, there's a number of apps in the you know, iPhone store or the Google Store. The important thing is to be able to control your shutter speed and set a slow shutter with any of them. We were and we have an article on that on Olympus site. And if people go to our website under workshops, there's a whole article with some example images on intentional camera movement right on the workshop side of our website. So this is the time where you can give the plug so so what's your website address? We're how do we reach it? We welcome everyone to visit our galleries and our website. It's Merrill images.com. That's two R's, two L's and we also have an Instagram page where we post regularly with lots of tips for photography. gruffy we urge people to reach out to us with any photo questions at all. And we hope people will join us sometime on one of our photo workshops or tours. It's always a pleasure. And they are so grateful to be your guest today. And thank you. Well, thank you too, for coming. And welcome to the first podcast for my new jounal office. And so we're all starting to do right. Did we miss you much success this summer? I hope you when you come down to Seattle, let us know we'll grab a beer. I would like that I do get down to Seattle every couple of weeks and check in with our officer fishermen's terminal. But say hi to my sister Carrie, and my captain Tam and all my friends from Whidbey Island. Thank you so much for coming on, we will try to send some good business your way we're looking forward to having you on when things get settled down from COVID and march and down this great path of adventure and photography together. Right. It's so much thank you. And thanks everybody for joining us today. It's always great to get tips not only on the techniques of photography like the Merrill's we're sharing with us and also wasn't a great that they shared. It's kind of the headspace app to get headspace it isn't always just looking straight out the camera. I love that stuff. With that. Feel free to check out this podcast anywhere podcasts are found you can tune into this. And we look forward to having you up in Alaska where I'm at right now just feet away from the safari question. Day after tomorrow, the Wilderness Explorer and all our boats headed north to Alaska. Let me say it again. Nord through Alaska rushes on, and we look forward to your thanks for listening to no ordinary adventure sharing locally harvested stories about adventure. Be sure to subscribe leave a review tell a friend and help spread the word we are a community of nature lovers, intrepid travelers and outdoor adventurers mostly from the comfort of